Christina Bradley 00:10
This week, I am talking to the very lovely Nikki Raby. Nikki has such an impressive portfolio career that pulls and weaves together so many strands of her creativity. She is an actor, qualified life and business coach. She's also a writer, and a speaker and her specialism is really helping people to build thriving, profitable, and really fulfilling personal brands for themselves. Her podcast dreaming and doing with Nicki rabee, regularly featured on the top 100 business podcast on iTunes, and it has had over wait for it 100,000 downloads, which for someone releasing their 12th episode today, I me is pretty humbling and pretty darn impressive. In this episode, we talk about creating, building and actually sustaining a portfolio career with Nicky sharing so much insight and knowledge from her own creative journey. One of the things I think I appreciate most about Nikki, which is really evident throughout our conversation is just her ability to dream really, really big, and of course, help others do the same, while at the exact same time remain grounded. It's such an awesome combination, and one that is actually essential when it comes to successfully navigating a creative path. So let's get into it. Nikki, It's so lovely to have you on the podcast. Thank you so much for joining me today.
Nicky Raby 02:15
Thank you so much for inviting me What a treat to speak to another human being
Christina Bradley 02:22
I know it feels a bit like that right now, doesn't it? Now, I am so keen to have you on the show. And I've wanted to speak to you for a while because I feel like what you're doing with your career is really quite inspiring. And I think it will really resonate with lots of the listeners. Because I think you have such a strong example of a creative portfolio career that obviously encompasses many different things. And I wonder if you could just start by giving us a little introduction to you and sort of helping us understand what your journey looked like from when you began your creative career.
Nicky Raby 02:59
Yeah, of course. So, portfolio career, creative career career, I was kind of doing it when nobody sort of mentioned creativity or doing what you love. It very much came from a case that people were like, No, just do what your dad did, or just do what somebody in your village did, it was about following the pack. So I knew from quite an early age that this might have a long and windy, twisty journey. But in a nutshell, at nearly 40 I am an actor. So well, I guess I earn money from which is what we want to talk about, I guess I earn money Exactly. Being an actor, a coach, a writer, a speaker and a podcaster. And bizarrely, they all sort of fall and twist together in being my personal brand. And that's taken me a long time to get to that situation. Because also when it started, it was very much to do more than one thing. So as soon as you started to look at other areas, so I started as an actor I trained. I wasn't a child actor, but I've certainly been doing it since I was four years old and semi professionally as well. And then finally moved to London when I was 18 and went to drama school for three years. And yeah, hit the ground running. I definitely feel like I got I was one of those lucky people that got an agent from their showcase. I got two jobs back. So I was employed for the first six months of leaving drama school,
Christina Bradley 04:34
Which is amazing, by the way for people listening that aren't familiar with the world of acting, that is really quite an achievement.
Nicky Raby 04:41
Thank you it felt really I mean, it wasn't you know, it wasn't Spielberg. But it was really lovely actually to make that sense of creativity real because I was saying this to somebody the other day, actually that I was really lucky that I was able to cottoned on to the fact quite early on in drums. goal that I was here, not only to learn and to be in this playful, creative space where I could experiment and do all kinds of things, but I was actually here and people were watching to see if I could be employable. So if I could transfer my creativity to actually being reliable, professional, show up on time consistent, all of those sorts of things and be part of somebodies crew, their sets their companies. So I was really fortunate that I twigged to that, like, Oh, you know, now is not the time to be a big balling wreck. You know, I felt like I really separated my teenage angst and get that at home. But when I was at drama school, I was like, right, I'm here to do what I need to do. And then sort of Yeah, from there had a lot of years of being a jobbing actor, and sometimes being a really successful one, and sometimes being a terrible one. And it was really hard in those early days, because we didn't have what we have. Now we didn't have eight zeds, I was, we had an eight of those rather, I was wandering around Soho, trying to find a casting studio, I felt like the creative people with the with the the say, so the decision maker, and all behind this fence that you couldn't read. So you couldn't follow somebody on Twitter, you only knew about people if you kept them, or if somebody had already been for the same part that you were going for. So it was a lot of work in progress. And a lot of really great times, and then a lot of really challenging times of trying to earn money and running out all over London, and also trying to figure out who you are, as a human being It was quite a lot. And then just before my 30th, I was like, right, I've got to do something, and I've got a brain and I'm bright, and I'm sharp and entrepreneurial, what can I do. And that's when I've trained to be a coach. And this is at the time where coaching was not really spoken about in the UK, we weren't talking about mental health or self development or anything like that. And it really got to open my eyes to the possibility that I could continue my creativity. And I bring a lot of creativity into my coaching work now. And also, I can have autonomy over not just waiting for somebody to say yes, or give me permission that I can keep this other life this home life alive and kicking and in a really great strong place, which bizarrely then increased my acting work, because I was going in, not in a owner need this job, because I will always, you know, do my best. But I didn't have that desperation anymore, because other areas of my life were really full. And then the writing and the speaking and the podcasting has come as a source of Yeah, as kind of lovely extra as lovely sprinkles on the top. So that's kind of where I'm up to this point. And that sort of I've just hopped, skipped and jumped about 20 years. But that's the short version.
Christina Bradley 08:16
No, I love it. And that was a really clear a clear version of the kind of the sequence of events. And if we may, I would just like to jump back to the kind of the acting era. I know you're still doing it. But I'm, I guess I'm really interested about the time where it sort of was the be all and end all and everything was kind of about those auditions. And you know, the world of acting is as much about the rejection and dealing with the rejection as it is about actually getting the parts. And I'm just wondering if you can talk a little bit because I feel like our fear of rejection becomes such a block to our creativity. And I'm just wondering, Nikki, how you've dealt with rejection in the past, whether you've been able to kind of use it to keep yourself buoyant and to and to keep sort of believing in yourself or whether Actually, it's just kind of a struggle.
Nicky Raby 09:09
Yeah, there's definitely been times where for a split second I've gone maybe I've missed the boat, maybe if this didn't happen by 19, then I should give it up. And bizarrely, I've never lost faith in myself. But sometimes I fall in and had frustration around what's going on me around me. So for example, friends, you know, look, I do have friends in the industry, but a lot of my kind of close friends are not in the industry at all. So I do remember that moment where suddenly the graduate jobs were coming to an end and suddenly people started earning like serious cash in London, you know, last people do like, yeah, I'm 27 I just bring home like five grand a month Easy peasy. And suddenly when you notice that kind of lifestyle going up, it can really affect you. Because there is such a emphasis on money, I think. And you know, if you've got the money to wear the fancy outfit, or you know, drop loads of money in a London bar and sort of live the swanky lifestyle, and that can be really hard to upkeep if you're trying to follow a creative dream, because usually with creativity, and it's not always the case, usually the money takes a while to catch up with you But in terms of the rejection, it was really hard actually, when you got the near misses. So I remember getting a job when I was about 22 or 23. And it was one of those auditions where I went in, and I was just thinking like this job, this job feels like me. Like, I remember that woman looking at me in that, oh, my goodness, you were who I had on my piece of paper, like you Look who I you know, and sometimes y'all go to an audition, everybody's got long red hair, like I have, and everybody looks the same. But there was something about the connection that I had with that casting director. And then immediately she was like, you can you just say around, I just I need to PC with somebody. And by the end of that, I was like, I've got this job, this is going to be great. And I did, I got the job. And we were all set to go. And this job was worth 17,000 pounds, oh, for like two days work. And then my agent phoned me and they said, we've made a mistake, you are not 25 yet. And in order to advertise alcohol in this country, you have to be 25. And so legally, I wasn't allowed to do the job. And that was a stinger. Because as an actor to have that kind of money suddenly come in, you spend it in your head, you're like,
Christina Bradley 12:03
of course you do
Nicky Raby 12:04
Going to go on holiday, I'm gonna do whatever. And, you know, that's how I was thinking. So those rejections of the near misses like I had one where I was down to the last two for Emmerdale and like various things, they're really hard because you start to see that fork in the road of where the sliding doors moment of where your life could go. But generally, it's one of those things where I've actually come back to this motto, which is just be good every time, be good. Every time show up, don't take your whatever into the into room, if I can swear, but you know what I'm saying. So don't take the shit into the room, leave it and deal with that in a way that you need to. So whether that is therapy, or yoga, or running or talking to a friend over a bottle of wine, whatever it is, but don't take it into the room. Because one thing that I've realised is, for me, it's not about that spike of getting the job or not, it's Can I keep myself in the game topped up, ready to go in the right frame of mind for most of the time. And that has been game changing for me, because my agent now will phone and say, Can you do something tomorrow? And if I'm still in recovery from something that didn't go my way, in November, the push back on that it's going to be so long, and it's gonna be so frustrating. My poor agent would be like, why have you not dealt with this from November like you've got there's plenty more fish in the seat, that sort of situation. So for me, rejection is about how much I let of it into my story. Now, that's not to say where they go, Oh, darling, I didn't realise you'd be so short. Or like, we're looking for somebody thinner. And you're like, Okay, great, fine, no problem. And you know, but it was a time in those early 2000s, where people would point and whisper and saying things to you and you have to go, alright, well, then it's not my job. And I am maybe I do have that sort of sense of like, what's meant for me work passed me by,
Christina Bradley 14:19
I mean, not so important. And what you just said, there really struck me it's really I guess it's that shift, isn't it from Steven pressfield talks about this. It's kind of like from amateur to turning pro. And I feel like what you've just described that it's just having this like, real professionalism about you that you walk into that audition room and whatever else is going on. You've kind of you've got your game face on and you can deliver and you can count on yourself to deliver.
Nicky Raby 14:44
Yes, and one thing that that has come from because that didn't come that's come from, you know, being an actor for nearly 30 years and going into these rooms that have been, you know, I started professionally auditioning when I was about 10 or 11. So it's happened a lot Time, but also I've got enough data now that sometimes jobs come in the weirdest and the most wonderful ways. So if I am closed off to those opportunities, or if I'm too busy being in the headspace of, it's not fair, I close off other opportunities that perhaps I haven't even considered yet. So that's been a really important part of the journey as well, because I've got the data to support that, like, just stay in the game rabee, off you go.
Christina Bradley 15:32
Yeah, but that is, I think that is so important. And I think that that is also really applicable to so many other creative pursuits beyond just acting, you know, I think about with my writing, it's that sort of showing up every day to write even when I don't necessarily feel like it, you know, and having that discipline to sit down with yourself and just do the work. And I think that that's the area of creativity that sometimes we all miss, because we want it to be the fun, playful stuff. But actually, there is a real kind of work ethic that's required as well, if you want to see results.
Nicky Raby 16:05
Absolutely, absolutely. And sometimes you do get those lucky breaks, or you get those like magic keys where people come in this way. Come on, I've got I'll show you the way. But generally, there will come a time, even if you've had loads of luck, that you still need to be in the game, you still need to be doing the stuff day in and day out. And you have to want it. I think that's really important as well. It's like, Do I want the story of the rejection? And it's not fair and may go for girls who have this, this and this to be my story? Or do I want to live in the excitement of something could happen tomorrow, and it could change my life. And you have to be really conscious, I think about what you can control. And one of the things that you can control is your own thoughts about it and your own perspective.
Christina Bradley 17:05
Yeah, yeah, I think that's so true. And so then towards me about how you said you were around 30, where you sort of made the transition, and you thought, right, I'm going to sort of take more ownership over my my income, potentially, and my career and go into coaching. So did you take a course? Was that how that worked? did you do? Uh,
Nicky Raby 17:28
I was working as an agent at the time. So I again, that was one of those weird things that happened. I was doing a play at the hack the Empire. And one of the actors in there had her own agency. And one day, her assistant didn't show up. And I was like, Oh, do it. Come on, I'll answer the phone, blah, blah, blah. And we were good pals at that stage. So you know, and she kind of it wasn't just a random like, oh, okay, sure you. So she kind of knew what I was all about. And that continued for about five years. And that was a real insight, actually, behind the scenes of the acting industry and how it works. And I recommend it to any asset. If you ever get the opportunity to go and sit in an agent's office, do it because it will really break down the facade, I guess, because so many agents like my agent hates me, they never show up for work, they have so many things. And absolutely, they're really lovely people mainly, and they're just trying to do a good job. But that's another story for another time. There are some scumbag ones, of course, but I haven't met too many of those, fortunately, apart from one who stole all my money, but that again, that's a very different story. But one thing that I was noticing was that that agency in particular had a big a big emphasis on strategy, as in this person is here. And this is where they want to get to how do we build that strategy, rather than just throwing spaghetti at the wall and hoping for the best and let's be really discerning and build it from the ground up. And with that, and being in that environment, I suddenly started to say, oh, maybe it's way more logical than I thought because I was of the school of thought maybe that I was just waiting and maybe one day something might pop up and then I sort of realised Oh no, you can start the plan already yourself to get yourself ready. So I did some additional, like I did a free weekend course with coaching. And then by the end of the weekend course, I found myself signing up for this course which I'd never even thought about. But bizarrely, it suited all my strengths and it suited and the way that I thought about it and I thought you know what, it's going to be one of those skills that I can just use it will be like something having in your back pocket, a trend, essentially At all times, and honestly, it was one of the best things that I did. Because it's just helped me so much. Knowing that I can apply those skills or I can create courses, I can do anything like that. And also, I think it changed my life looking at that self development and knowing that if I was going to grow and do bigger things, and really sort of step into who I wanted to be, I was going to have to, it was like, it was like redesigning a garden, it was like, Oh, my gosh, I'm gonna have to pull up some weeds and I'm gonna move some stuff around in order to get the fruits of my labour because I did feel like I was carrying around a lot of weeds and negativity or old stories that people told me about myself. And they weren't true and limiting beliefs. And my goodness, I'm not perfect. And I'm not healed by any means now, but I have had, I've done a lot of work on myself. And I've done a lot of self development. And at that time, it came at the perfect time, because again, there's that well, you know, as well from your writing 30, suddenly that pressure where you feel like you ought to know exactly what you're doing with your life, and most of us don't.
Christina Bradley 21:19
Quite Exactly, exactly. And so and so from there, you made that transition into coaching. And did you when you were doing that, Nikki, I'm really curious, were you already aware of this idea of a portfolio career and you were already sort of being quite strategic about it thinking, Oh, I can bring in my acting. And then maybe this gives me the opportunity of building other strands to my career, or were you just sort of following the sort of a logical next step? How strategic were you?
Nicky Raby 21:51
I think I was strategic. There was certainly a moment where I was like, I got to be strategic about it. So but throughout my 20s you know, the acting work was coming in. I was earning money from doing agent work and also is doing bits of nannying for rich folk in southwest London, who you know, it was lovely, like, oh, there's a lovely lunch. Can you just take these kids to the park? Yeah, sure. Great. Oh, yeah. My lifestyle at that time. And you know, there'll be a sort of like a 13 pound salad that they just picked up from Harrods on the way home, I was like, yeah, that will suit me. That's lovely. Thank you. 13 pounds for a salad now, like, I'm looking back going, Wow, that's a lot of money anyway. Yeah, that so I would, I definitely felt like there was this bit where I was kind of, I didn't have enough evidence yet to lean on one particular thing. So by default, I guess I was in this octopus type situation where I was having a bit from here. And I just, I guess with that as well, it felt, I felt that sense of unbalanced because there was a lot of stuff going on. I was always juggling. I always felt like I was running that moment. I don't know in Sex in the City, where you see Carrie Bradshaw, like, go down into the subway along the pack platform, she goes up. Oh, gosh, what time I've missed it. And that's what how I always felt. So I didn't feel sort of solid in that. But at the end of 2014, I made a decision. Because also as well, at that time, I'd been an agent and I was making other people's dreams come true. That was my job, essentially, like put people up for work. And then phone them and tell them they got the job like those life changing, like you got the job and you're going to be earning 20,000 pounds. Like you got the job. And you fly tomorrow. Although yeah,
Christina Bradley 23:46
that's pretty good news to be delivering, isn't it?
Nicky Raby 23:49
Yeah, exactly. And also, though, I mean, you know, if I'm going to be honest and human about it is that sometimes that was really hard, because I felt like I wasn't putting enough of myself in to the game of really, you know, I was giving so much to other people. And then I suddenly thought, Gosh, if you're going to go ahead and you're going to do this, then you've got to be really mindful about it. Not in a sort of Time's running out. But like, Are you in or out? What are you doing? And I felt like I was dabbling. So like we sort of talked about before, it was like, I've got to make a bold decision here. So at the end of 2014, I was like, right, I'm going to go all in. I'm going to see what happens. So I stopped all of my consistent work as in, I was no longer kind of contracted to turn up somewhere for a number of hours per week, each week. And I cut everything off. And I don't know if I do that now because I've got two children. Right. I didn't raise very brave. Yeah, and I think that's important to say as well like I was in a position where because I think also this creative dream of like just go in and say see You guys, I'm off. Yeah, that's really sexy, and, you know, looks lovely in a film. But please don't do anything that puts yourself at such risk. And I think certainly there were times where I have put myself at risk in terms of, you know, I don't think there's anything attractive going, I've just got 80 pounds left in my bank account and a big dream. It's like, no, that's quite hideous.
Christina Bradley 25:24
And yeah, and very, very frightening.
Nicky Raby 25:26
Yeah, there's nothing attractive about that situation. And I will say, I have been in that situation in my 20s, where I'm just and it's just not what I want to be doing. Anyway, I digress. But yeah, I had a mobile, I
Christina Bradley 25:38
think I'm pleased you said that. Because I think that that is a, I think that is a really good point to make. Because I do think that often, we feel like it's got to be all or nothing, you know, if I'm gonna chase down my creative dreams, and I have to give up everything else. And it's like, well, you could do that. Sure. But that puts a lot of pressure on your creativity to deliver. And sometimes you might want to go for a more gentle, softer approach. So I am really happy that you mentioned that, but sorry, carry on back to Yeah, so
Nicky Raby 26:05
Well, I was just so yeah, I went all in. And then I was like, Okay, let's see what happens and stuff started to happen. And, like, opportunities came out of nowhere, and I suddenly could increase my income. And speaking gigs started to happen. And then people asked me to write for them. And then so that was the November and then in January, I got pregnant with my son, which again, is perfect timing. And, you know, if you're not really sure what you're doing great, baby, throw baby into the mix. Do it. And and, you know, that was that was stressful. It was full on at the time at but I also and I catch him sometimes, like we look at each other. And he I feel like he's seen stuff in me that nobody else in the world has seen because he's seen me pacing around the streets. He's seen that really roar, vulnerable side of me that I would only maybe keep for myself. And it's Yeah, that's relationships really interesting. Because sometimes he clocks me like, I don't know, if you've been true to yourself. I'm like, but you're five, how do you think he just knows my face? Because we looked at each other for so long. And so yeah, that's what happened at the beginning of 2015. And I had him in twin, October 2015. And then from there, bizarrely, more acting work has come back again, and more opportunities. And I finally feel like I've over the last five years, like I've really gathered pace, and I've had a lot of ups and downs in that time, like you do with any kind of growth where you go, I'm doing it, I'm doing it. I'mdoing Oh, didn't go to that I'm doing it. I'm running into the living room of like, I think my website's gone live, or no, it hasn't come off the internet. Like I think there's are no it Yeah, but that's what happens. When you're in the game, you're gonna fall over sometimes, and you're gonna make mistakes, and you're gonna have to be really nimble on your feet.
Christina Bradley 28:14
Yeah, and just keep brushing yourself off and getting back up. Living to fight another day.
Nicky Raby 28:20
Yes.
Christina Bradley 28:21
So let's just let's just talk for a moment about your your actual coaching, because you're a specific type of coach, aren't you? And you focus on branding, personal branding. Is that it? That's right in saying that, aren't I?
Nicky Raby 28:33
Yes. So it's definitely like, I trained as a life coach. And then the sort of more business coaching came in as in that was the title that I used for a while. But actually, for me, it's more about the individual. So I'm not doing that business coach of like, I'm going to TEDx your income here within half an hour supervision. You zactly because also, that doesn't, age doesn't appealed. And you can't do that in half an hour. And a doesn't appeal to me because it has to come down to the individual. So your goals, your circumstances, your personality, as well. And so this sweet spot of personal branding, coaching has really started to come to life because I for a long time was looking for this niche. And people always say you're going to niche down Who's your ideal client? And I was like, I don't know, because all these different people keep coming to me and it's really exciting and I'm loving it, but in terms of recording them for a graph, like it looks a bit Higgledy Piggledy, but one thing I found was this common denominator that people wanted to build a personal brand and they needed support, going, What is this thing? How do I present it? How do I package it? And how do I get it to sing for me and do all those things that people want to talk about, like get opportunities to their inbox without reading Trying or, you know, what else can I think of like make passive income? How can you work less hours and earn more all that kind of stuff? Because I guess that came from that I was coaching yoga instructors, app developers, journalists, people who worked in the media, actors, social media managers, but that was the through line, people wanted to go, Okay, this is my pick and mix. These are my skills, my talents, my circumstances, this is how I want to show up, how can I do this? How can I get more eyes on what I do? How can I earn more? And how can I make it work with the rest of my life?
Christina Bradley 30:43
So how important then, is this idea of authenticity, because I think so often when, when people are having to sort of put themselves out there and you know, whether it's, you know, starting up your own business, or is with any of your kind of creative work, this whole idea of sort of doing the work in the background, and then having to present it to the big wide world, and remain authentic, and really stay true to your your own voice, I think is a real challenge. And I'm just wondering whether you've experienced that working with, with the number of clients that you have,
Nicky Raby 31:23
I think it's really hard, because suddenly, it makes it real. And I even found it really hard. Even though I have that element of Showtime, you know, the show must go on, crack on, there's an audience there, off you go, you know, I never was sort of precious about, you know, oh, I don't know if I can do it today or this, it's like, No, do what you say that you're going to do and do the job and get on with it, that I probably go way too far that end. But I think this sense of suddenly, not only being skilled in your area, but then suddenly have to share it to the world and be a walking talking sandwich board, marketing your services at all times. It's really hard. But I think that the way to authenticity for me, has almost been to absorb all of the stuff, and then see what sticks or learn all the scripts, and then throw them away, and really try and listen to what's going on inside rather than what all the outside world is telling me they need to do. Because if I look at my own data, as it were, the people who work with me, or the moments where people say, I'm ready, how can I book Let's go, I'm really excited to do this. When's your next availability? That's not because they said, so I was in your sales funnel, and that one particularly jazzy button, you know, compelled me to convert. That's not how people talk necessarily. So if you can, I guess, show up as much as you would in real life and let that lead, and then put all the systems in place to support that. That's going to be something that's quite sustainable, and also real. I, I love automation. And I can see, I can see the benefits of it. You know, there are if we I love having things on direct debit, for example, like, Oh, great,
Christina Bradley 33:31
it's gone out.
Nicky Raby 33:32
It's done. It's paid. And if I suddenly have to go by what am I paying on a third? What am I doing on the set? Oh, right. Oh, gosh, that's another thing to do. But what we have to remember, I think, with any conversation, or any interaction with another human being is that we have to be mindful that we're talking with people. And one thing I've really realised is to ask for help, or to pay for help as well. I mean, that's another conversation. Sometimes people put themselves in a really raw position that they're maybe not used to, you know, sometimes it's that case. So I've met people for coaching sessions, and at the end of it, they go, feel so good to say out loud, I've never told anybody that like that happens all the time. Because there's this sense of showing who you really are to your to not only to yourself, but to one other person before you go open. And I really struggle when people just say just get more visible. You need to get more eyes on your stuff. And actually, it's usually an internal moment of easing into it. And back in 2013 when I started talking about before that 2011 started talking about coaching and putting on Facebook, I mean, I'm sure people thought I'd lost
Christina Bradley 34:53
my mind like,
Nicky Raby 34:54
What's she doing? What, what, no, don't be coming over here and trying to change who I am like Don't need people like you, it was sort of that, you know, door to door salesperson, hide upstairs don't go near because there is that sense of all that stuff that's happened before. But I know that that works for me. And you know, whoever's listening will have their own version of that. But even though people will say have this professionalism have this way of doing stuff, you have to be a human being as well, if you want to be in the game for as long as I've been, or as long as you want to be. Because people buy from humans, I think,
Christina Bradley 35:36
yeah, no, absolutely. They do. Absolutely. And what would you say, Nikki? Do you have like a top tip for people who are really struggling to find First of all, and then really use their own voice? Would you have like a couple of techniques or tips that they could kind of use? Or how would you recommend they approach that?
Nicky Raby 35:56
The first one I would say is I always if I can't find the answer, I always ask myself what it isn't. So if I'm going, I don't know what my brand is, I don't know how to describe myself. go the other way. Go. The extreme is that what am I not? I don't want to be that. Oh, that. Think about? You know, you don't want to save this negativity space for too long. But that sense of like, Oh, God, I don't want to do Oh, it's really weird when they send you those emails and like, they're really, oh, no, I don't want to do that. So almost working through that process. Another thing that I would say, and I get my clients to do it, and sometimes I get them to do it on the phone with me, and they hate it. But at the end of it, they're like, Okay, I see what you're saying, is to read your website out loud, or to read your blog out loud, and see how it fits. Because sometimes people go Nikki, Ruby is a personal branding,
Christina Bradley 36:55
changes.
Nicky Raby 36:56
And then I'll get to sentence three, I'm like, Who is this whole? Like? Nice, like, what is this odd thing. And I think there's such a power in terms of reading stuff out loud, or doing it from an improvisation. I mean, this is the kind of actor coming into play. But wandering around your house into, you know, thinking, I mean, do it when everybody's out, but you know, going, this is what I do, this is who I help. Yeah, this is sort of my vibe. And this is what it could look like if we work together. And I have this package. And you might like this, and this is perfect for people who are starting out. But this one would really sit, you know, go through that whole process of making it real and making it in your body. So it comes out really easily because then when you start because otherwise what can happen is you sit at your laptop, and you go. So some digital marketers said it should be four paragraphs, and I should start with a strong header and you go, Oh, I don't know how to fit what I am into that exaggerated. Whereas if you do it the other way and go, I'm just going to tell the whole story and get it all out in the open and then trim it and edit it from there. Because that whole story will never be wasted. Because you can use it for your content. You can use it in podcast interviews, you can use it for blog posts, it's all part of your story.
Christina Bradley 38:23
And because it's part of your story, it isn't itself authentic. Right. So it's all very usable and very relatable.
Nicky Raby 38:30
Absolutely. And within that as well though, you get to decide how authentic you want to be. And I think that's important to say because sometimes people go Oh, my goodness, does that mean I have to be vulnerable? Do I have to you have to talk about my divorce? Do I have to say like how I broke down a relationship with my mom. No, I never see you know, you don't have to do that whole Jeremy Kyle or piers Morgan's life stories like that, you know, there are some things that about my life that people will never ever know, because they're not on the internet because I choose not to share them there. And that's, that's my and your prerogative. We can choose how much we reveal and that's not about being secretive. It's just like saying is it's not appropriate to say that like an you know, an accountant, if you book an accountant and you have a one on one meeting, you know, you don't need him to go halfway through. Do you know what? I have a really disorganised pants draw. You'd be like, great, you can you can have your disorganised pants. I don't need to know about it. But I think this is the thing if you're a service based business, or if people need to get to know you, sometimes there's this pressure to want to share everything. And you really don't you can listen to what feels good for you. Right? I
Christina Bradley 39:49
was just gonna say that and actually trust yourself enough to know what you're willing to share. And what actually you choose to hold back. I think it all comes down to what you'll come Whether what you decide is, is going to be right.
Nicky Raby 40:03
Yes. Because once you've said it, you can't unsay it. My mum always says,
Christina Bradley 40:08
Well, that is words of wisdom from Mrs. Raby.
Nicky Raby 40:13
Very true. Yeah. Because we've all been on those nights out where suddenly people say, Oh my gosh, like, let me tell you a secret. I'm like, No, no, no, don't
Christina Bradley 40:22
do it.
Nicky Raby 40:24
Because if you took what you've told me, I mean, you know, I'm a good secret keeper. But like, once you've told me, you've told me.
Christina Bradley 40:31
Yeah, exactly. And I think, you know, it is that thing that you, you know, in your heart, how much how far you're willing to go. I know, with my writing, I've, I've kind of taken it to a point. And I'm like, okay, I can't go further than that. But I know I can go up until till that point. And I'm comfortable with that. And that still feels really honest, really truthful. But I haven't taken myself into a point where I feel exposed. And so I'm still kind of I'm not vulnerable, I'm keeping myself relatively safe within the world of creativity, which sometimes doesn't feel safe.
Nicky Raby 41:02
Exactly. And also, if you know that you're in it for the long game, that we're not here just to sell a story or to do a one off exclusive, then you have to listen to what that thru line is going to be and make sure that it is appropriate and insert, you know, because they've been acting jobs that have come through and I'm like, I'm going to say no, because if I don't say no, I'm going to have to say no to or other people will say no to me on lots of different situations. So playing the long game as well is. Yeah, it's hard at the time sometimes because you're like, oh, but I could could I? You have to say no, because otherwise Oh, it just gets messy.
Christina Bradley 41:45
Yeah. And your future self will not thank you for it. Like I told you, so. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Oh, Nikki, this has been such a wonderful chat. Thank you so so much. Before I let you go, I've just got one final question that I asked all of my guests, I would love to know what living a creative life means to you.
Nicky Raby 42:04
Oh, living a creative life for me is Do you know what it's like? The only way that I know. And it's something that it's something that's so inherent in me. It's like knowing that I need to eat breakfast every morning, that I have to honour it, and give it the love and attention that it needs. Because if I don't, if I move so far away from who I am as a person, and that's such a hard battle to like when I'm not in alignment, when I'm not. When I'm not instinctive when I'm not on my path. Oh, it's so tough because you feel like you're just like dancing on ice otherwise. So I really learned that living a creative life is it needs attention. It needs love. It's a relationship that I continuous. And it's not something that's just frivolous or a nice to have, or a jolly things on the side. It's something that just lives through every part of me. Oh,
Christina Bradley 43:17
God, I love that answer so much. I'm sat here and I'm just like, yes, that's exactly how I feel. I need attention. I think that's such a beautiful, so beautifully put because, yeah, it's not accidental. It needs to be purposeful and intentional.
Nicky Raby 43:32
Because it was that case, and I'm sure for you as well at school, like it was seen as something a bit silly, like, Oh, she's a bit artist. She's a bit dramatic because she's an actress. And what's been happening in 2012. And I wasn't really you know, I'm not I'm not a shouty Ko, not a dramatic person. I mean, I have my moments, of course, but what has everybody been doing in lockdown, creativity, cooking, watching things that have been made on TV, craving live music events, and you know, I'm not doing a torture. So creativity is important, but it really is. It's, I think, if he knows so much, and I can't bear it that some people were told, like, Oh, no, you're academic. You're not creative. Because they're, I think it's in everybody. I really do to relate to that lesser or greater degree.
Christina Bradley 44:21
Yeah, I completely agree with that. And I think you know, I talk about it so much on the show the fact that it feels like there's this weird sort of them and us, you know, there's the creatives, and then there's the people that just aren't creative. And that is just, I feel like the biggest misconception about creativity because innately, we are all creative beings. Yes. So it's so lovely hearing everything that you've said today, and I think it's just going to provide so much value for everyone listening. So thank you, Nikki. And if people want to hang out with you work with you find you follow you. How do they go about doing that?
Nicky Raby 44:51
I mean, I'm on the internet all the time. So you can come over
Christina Bradley 44:56
and over and play.
Nicky Raby 44:58
Come over and play I'm at Nikki rabee ni ck YRABY Instagrams, probably my favourite place to hang out, but I have a podcast as well. There's loads of episodes and interviews and mini episodes on there as well or my website. But if anything's resonated today and you're like, I just feel like I need to talk to you. You can book a free 15 minute session, I always do a free consult, so no pushy sales for I mean, I'm exactly who I am on this call as in like, I'm not going to go right. Let's go into everything. So yeah, if anything has struck a chord or you're interested in growing your personal brand, yeah, all the details are on my website, Nikki Raby. com.
Christina Bradley 45:42
Thank you, Nicky. And I will put all of those in the show notes below so people can find them very easily.
Nicky Raby 45:47
Wonderful. Thank you so much for such a lovely conversation.
Christina Bradley 45:51
Oh, it's been such a treat. Nikki, thank you so much.